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How to respond to infeasible advice? (was: Software Job Market Myths)
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| Robert Maas, see http://tinyurl.com/uh3t 2005-08-18, 5:58 pm |
| > From: CBFalconer <cbfalco...@yahoo.com>
> He seems to be full of reasons why he can't do 'that', for any value
> of 'that'.
That's not true. For some values of 'that', I don't have the resources
to perform the task, don't have any money to purchase the resources,
and am not the kind of person to mug people on the street to get the
money to buy the resources, nor the type of person to shoplift at
Fry's Electronics to directly get the needed equipment.
For other values of 'that', I do have the resources, so if the idea
seems worthwhile I go ahead and give it a try.
When the modem on my laptop was working, I tried downloading J2EE,
installing it, and then tried using it for my Distributed Java class.
It took 6-8 hours on my 39MB-RAM Linux laptop to install a single
sample EJB application that came with the J2EE documentation, and once
installed I learned that deploytool had a bug whereby it was impossible
to upgrade the EJB to match changed source (ANT compiled the source
just fine, but deploytool claimed the EJB was already up to date and
refused to install the changed code). I tried installing other kinds of
J2EE applications, and the only one that both installed and was
updatable (but *without* using deploytool) was the JSP application,
where you don't need deploytool to update the application, you just
edit the JSP source and the next time you try to load that application
the server auto-compiles it. I also found that with J2EE running on my
39MB-RAM Linux laptop, the whole system was horrendously slow, with it
taking appx. 20 seconds just to switch to a different window when I
clicked on it.
So then I spent several w s working out a hack to bypass the
deploytool bug that affects all applications except JSP applications,
and the slow-computer situation that affected **everything** on the
computer whenever J2EE was running, and finally was able to complete
the HttpServlet homework assignment, by cross-circuiting from the
working JSP application to a fake HttpServlet interface that I wrote
myself that could run in both J2EE mode (from the JSP) and J2SE mode
(from a test rig I wrote myself). So I could do all my development in
J2SE mode using the test rig, then switch to J2EE STOA (*) mode for
final validation test about once per day or two when I had a major
feature fully implemented and working in the test rig.
* (Slow Talkers Of America - Bob and Ray comedy skit)
So here's the deal: If somebody suggests something for me to do, but I
don't have the resources to do it, should I:
#1 Just ignore them and let them wonder why I never responded?
#2 Tell them honestly what resources I don't have that would be needed
to do what they suggested? Maybe we can work out an alternate idea
that is similar to what was suggested but which is within my means,
if we talk about it.
#3 Lie and say I'm going to do something that I know I can't do?
#4 Commit a crime (mugging or shoplifting) to get the facilities I need?
#4 is not an option for me, but I threw it in just to see whether any
of you were expecting me to do that. I'm not comfortable with #3
either. I've been doing #2 but it causes too much of your kind of flak,
so I've tentatively decided to switch to #1, after this article.
Nobody has unlimited resources, not even Bill Gates. If somebody
suggested to Bill Gates that he should completely terraform the Sahara,
converting it back to farmland like it was about 50 thousand years ago,
building desalinization plants along the Mediterranean Sea and then
pumping the pure water through pipes to irrigate the new farmland,
would he immediately drain all the resources of his company to try to
do that, or would he explain that even MicroSoft doesn't have such
resources, not to mention that it wouldn't be profitable for him or his
company?
> "If you want to post a followup via groups.google.com, don't use
> the broken "Reply" link at the bottom of the article. Click on
> "show options" at the top of the article, then click on the
> "Reply" at the bottom of the article headers." - Keith Thompson
Ah, thanks for the suggestion. I'll give it a try right now...
I'm looking at this text&linklabels on screen:
CBFalconer Aug 13, 2:49 pm show options
Newsgroups: comp.programming, comp.software-eng
From: CBFalconer <cbfalco...@yahoo.com> - Find messages by this author
Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 18:49:24 GMT
Local: Sat, Aug 13 2005 2:49 pm
Subject: Re: Software Job Market Myths
Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | View Thread | Show
original | Report Abuse
So I click on "show options", and now I see exactly the same as before
except the cursor is now at the top of the screen instead of on the
"show options" linklabel. So anyway, moving cursor all the way down
to the "Reply" link, clicking on it, and I now see:
Sign-in
You must sign in to Google to complete the previous action.
New to Google Groups? Sign up now
So I click on that, and look ahead to spot possible problems:
______________________________
Word Verification:
Type the characters you see in the picture below.
If you can read this, you do not have images enabled. Please enable
images in order to proceed.
______________________________
My access to the net is VT100, so it's impossible to enable images.
Google actively discriminates against disabled people trying to use
their online services. If anybody knows of any agency in this area
which helps disabled people fight such discrimination, please tell me.
| |
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| Robert Maas, see http://tinyurl.com/uh3t wrote:
> That's not true. For some values of 'that', I don't have the resources
> to perform the task, don't have any money to purchase the resources,
> and am not the kind of person to mug people on the street to get the
> money to buy the resources, nor the type of person to shoplift at
> Fry's Electronics to directly get the needed equipment.
This has never stopped me.
> For other values of 'that', I do have the resources, so if the idea
> seems worthwhile I go ahead and give it a try.
Such as "be cheerful", "read a book on career management", and stop writing
web pages that say "I'm winning-challenged"?
> When the modem on my laptop was working, I tried downloading J2EE,
> installing it, and then tried using it for my Distributed Java class.
> It took 6-8 hours on my 39MB-RAM Linux laptop to install a single
> sample EJB application that came with the J2EE documentation, and once
> installed I learned that deploytool had a bug whereby it was impossible
> to upgrade the EJB to match changed source (ANT compiled the source
> just fine, but deploytool claimed the EJB was already up to date and
> refused to install the changed code).
That's nothing. I just tried to install Java, and I found a clicker in
Sun-land called "Windows Platform - J2EE SDK 1.4_02-2005Q2 UR2 FCS / J2EE
SDK 1.4 UR2, English". So I click this thing, and spend 8 hours downloading
stuff that I know I will never use, and which is now impossible to get rid
of.
Then I install it (with a dog-slow installer that slows all my other apps
down), and open a new CMD.EXE command prompt. Then I type Java and Javac,
and nothing happens.
How am I expected to figure out how to use this thing?? Did I actually
download Java, or something (obviously) compiled _with_ Java?
> I tried installing other kinds of
> J2EE applications, and the only one that both installed and was
> updatable (but *without* using deploytool) was the JSP application,
> where you don't need deploytool to update the application, you just
> edit the JSP source and the next time you try to load that application
> the server auto-compiles it. I also found that with J2EE running on my
> 39MB-RAM Linux laptop, the whole system was horrendously slow, with it
> taking appx. 20 seconds just to switch to a different window when I
> clicked on it.
We are up against two of Java's notorious difficulties. It expects a
humongous memory arena, or it swaps like crazy. And all these things
beginning with J have grown incestuously within an existing Java community.
They installed when it was easy and have simply upgraded ever since. This
profoundly di vantages any newcomers, because Sun has no incentive to
leave a trail of breadcrumbs along the most direct paths through their
jungle.
> So then I spent several ws working out a hack to bypass the
> deploytool bug that affects all applications except JSP applications,
> and the slow-computer situation that affected **everything** on the
> computer whenever J2EE was running, and finally was able to complete
> the HttpServlet homework assignment, by cross-circuiting from the
> working JSP application to a fake HttpServlet interface that I wrote
> myself that could run in both J2EE mode (from the JSP) and J2SE mode
> (from a test rig I wrote myself). So I could do all my development in
> J2SE mode using the test rig, then switch to J2EE STOA (*) mode for
> final validation test about once per day or two when I had a major
> feature fully implemented and working in the test rig.
Way. I wish I could even get that far.
> * (Slow Talkers Of America - Bob and Ray comedy skit)
>
> So here's the deal: If somebody suggests something for me to do, but I
> don't have the resources to do it, should I:
> #1 Just ignore them and let them wonder why I never responded?
You could switch to Ruby. It installs in 9 seconds, it doesn't thrash all
your caches, it comes with multiple GUI Toolkits and multiple CGI systems,
it installs new modules in one command line ("gem"), and it has an
infinitely better OO system than Java.
> #2 Tell them honestly what resources I don't have that would be needed
> to do what they suggested? Maybe we can work out an alternate idea
> that is similar to what was suggested but which is within my means,
> if we talk about it.
Try to do what they said, get stuck, and ask a polite and cheerful question
to the appropriate forum?
> My access to the net is VT100, so it's impossible to enable images.
> Google actively discriminates against disabled people trying to use
> their online services. If anybody knows of any agency in this area
> which helps disabled people fight such discrimination, please tell me.
You ain't disabled. Don't play the victim. And I thought Google detected and
responded correctly to text-mode browsers like Lynx.
--
Phlip
[url]http://www.greencheese.org/ZLand[/url] <-- NOT a blog!!!
| |
| Robert Maas, see http://tinyurl.com/uh3t 2005-08-23, 7:00 pm |
| > From: "Phlip" <phlip...@yahoo.com>
> I thought Google detected and responded correctly to text-mode
> browsers like Lynx.
Obviously you're mistaken, unless you consider the following to be
responding "correctly":
Start up lynx, go to this URL:
http://groups.google.com/group/comp...e06bfbd3e?hl=en
Relevant part on screen:
Reply | Reply to Author | Forward | Print | View Thread | Show
original | Report Abuse
Click on "Reply", relevant part of what's now on screen:
New to Google Groups? Sign up now
Click on "Sign up now", relevant part of what's now on screen:
Word Verification:
Type the characters you see in the picture below.
If you can read this, you do not have images enabled. Please enable
images in order to proceed.
______________________________
characters are not case-sensitive
Do you agree it'd be better for it to use some other way to verify
you're a human, not a 'bot, if your browser doesn't support images, and
that telling a Lynx user to please enable images is really stupid?
Why can't they be honest and say straight out "We discriminate against
anyone using Lynx or any other browser that doesn't allow us to dance
our annoying advertisements all over your screen making your experience
here so painful that you pay us money for premium service just to
esccape from our cruddy free service"?
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