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| Author |
Need informations about the Shareware Market.
|
|
| Stephan Jullian 2004-08-01, 3:56 am |
| Hi everybody,
i'm an old software developer (33 years old ;-) and I'd like to code some
app I have in mind for selling them over the Internet. The pb is that I do
have only my working time as wealth and cannot pay anything to put my
product(s) on the Internet (even if I think that there shouldn't be any
direct fee in the first step).
What I need is to have an idea of an average expect of selling over the
Internet. I know that question may sound stupid as I should define the type
of product, price range, target, and so on ... but as you may also
understand :
- I'm not sure about what I will code (of course I'll target the mass-market
and generally my customer do REALLY enjoy my app.interfaces and I have
probably developed more than a hundred software in many different domains
overs this past 11 years of professional coding),
- I have no idea of how many sells are a poor selling and how many is a good
one..
One day, I have readen a post about a guy that was selling 10 copies of a
software (very ugly and badly done from my point of view and not so usefull
except for some dedicated people) 40$ without any marketing campaign, just
by free search engine). Does this sound possible to you ?
Also :
How many month between the day you put the product on a website and on
search engine and the first sells ?
Is there any place where I can have an idea of sells done for different kind
of products ?
Is there a place where software author (shareware) chat about the market
aspect of their personal work and not global amount of the shareware biz
(except on ASP website which member registration is 100$ !!!!) ?
Seen the enormous number of shareware on dedicated websites, can we imagine
to be able to live with a shareware sells today (not specially a killer app
: a shareware like many other but that do its job correctly) ?
I'm very disappointed about the shareware market as I can't get any
information about the level of expectation a professional developer can
have..
I'll be very thankfull if you could give me some answer to these questions.
Thank you to you all in advance.
Best regards.
| |
|
| Hi Stephane,
I'll try to address a few of your questions.
On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 06:15:40 UTC, "Stephan Jullian"
<seriousguy06@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Hi everybody,
>
> i'm an old software developer (33 years old ;-) and I'd like to code some
> app I have in mind for selling them over the Internet. The pb is that I do
> have only my working time as wealth and cannot pay anything to put my
> product(s) on the Internet (even if I think that there shouldn't be any
> direct fee in the first step).
There are any number of ways that you could approach the advertisement
and delivery of your product. Most small scale commercial software is
handled on nearly free accounts from the company or developers home
system. You can purchase and run a site or have others sell your programs
for you.
IMO, most 'shareware' products aren't delivered with s ing a profit
at first. My rational for that is simply that the customer has an option
to pay but it allowed to use the product regardless of pay. Timeouts,
limited capacity, and other licensing schemes can help you a little. They
can confuse the customer more than anything else -- at what point do you
(the developer) want to become resposible for the product? For example,
would you help customers enough to get paid and then slack off? Its just
a reality that many developers don't stick with things over time. You
need a good business model more than anything else.
> What I need is to have an idea of an average expect of selling over the
> Internet. I know that question may sound stupid as I should define the type
> of product, price range, target, and so on ... but as you may also
> understand :
Your business model matter more than anything else. Treat it like a
normal home or brick-and-mortar business. The idea that "the internet"
is this great store is a myth. It is another medium to reach customers
just like television became a new medium to salesman who had radio
and newpapers and word of mouth.
Your sales will depend on many factors. I've had friends who have
done reasonably well for a few years but it was only to supplement
their income after they decided to create a good product and decided
it was ready for others to use.
My email package was developed an supported by two people many years
ago and they took the shareware route. They had wonderful service that
few, if any, companies could ever match. They were always around to
help. They were able to live off the profits and make a great name
for themselves.
I'm a bit older (40) with 23 years in the business. I've developed
stuff outside of work for free/share/sale too. If you have an idea
and business model that can work and you can get the customers to
beat down your door it may be worth giving it a try.
> - I'm not sure about what I will code (of course I'll target the mass-market
> and generally my customer do REALLY enjoy my app.interfaces and I have
> probably developed more than a hundred software in many different domains
> overs this past 11 years of professional coding),
> - I have no idea of how many sells are a poor selling and how many is a good
> one..
Your existing customer base is your best reference for your abilities.
If you plan on moving to the mass market, especially in terms of the
internet, please accept that offering to sell anything to everyone on the
planet may not get you more sales or profit than you would talking to people
in person and trying to make the sale.
> One day, I have readen a post about a guy that was selling 10 copies of a
> software (very ugly and badly done from my point of view and not so usefull
> except for some dedicated people) 40$ without any marketing campaign, just
> by free search engine). Does this sound possible to you ?
If one person said they did something like that, does it mean that its
the right thing for you and your products?
> Also :
>
> How many month between the day you put the product on a website and on
> search engine and the first sells ?
If customers spent all their effort trying to find products like yours
for their needs, what are the chances that they'd find it and then buy it?
If that is your only method for "getting the word out" for your product
expect zero sales, ever.
> Is there any place where I can have an idea of sells done for different kind
> of products ?
Read up on marketing, business practices, and so on. Hopefully you
picked up a little of this over your years developing products for other
people. How did they decide what to develop and how to reach the customer?
> Is there a place where software author (shareware) chat about the market
> aspect of their personal work and not global amount of the shareware biz
> (except on ASP website which member registration is 100$ !!!!) ?
There are all kinds of places. comp.software-eng is a rather poor place
to start. You might try listening to some of the posters in the various
programming groups. See also comp.programming and perhaps anything related
to your product ideas and of course sales and marketing.
> Seen the enormous number of shareware on dedicated websites, can we imagine
> to be able to live with a shareware sells today (not specially a killer app
> : a shareware like many other but that do its job correctly) ?
Define live with? If you mean "quit your day job" I don't think so.
That won't happen unless you become a marketing wizard or hook up with one.
At best you might supplement your income, especially in the $40 each
range.
> I'm very disappointed about the shareware market as I can't get any
> information about the level of expectation a professional developer can
> have..
A professional developer typically works for gauranteed pay or other
incentives. Even if you had a great game or whatever, its the salesman
in you that would translate the product into money.
You should probably examine what you are trying to do and see if there
is a better way of going about it. You may have some very good ideas
and growth potential. It won't happen over night.
> I'll be very thankfull if you could give me some answer to these questions.
>
> Thank you to you all in advance.
>
> Best regards.
David
| |
| Stephan Jullian 2004-08-01, 8:55 am |
| Thanks David for your advices,
does this mean that shareware developers can't live from their software ? Do
you know developer who can ? How much is the average earning among your
relatives in this business ?
Stephan.
"David" <FlyLikeAnEagle@United.Com> a écrit dans le message de
news:rOdGr40LMPU3-pn2-dKQHw7XznIUh@localhost...
> Hi Stephane,
>
> I'll try to address a few of your questions.
>
> On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 06:15:40 UTC, "Stephan Jullian"
> <seriousguy06@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
some[color=darkred]
do[color=darkred]
>
> There are any number of ways that you could approach the advertisement
> and delivery of your product. Most small scale commercial software is
> handled on nearly free accounts from the company or developers home
> system. You can purchase and run a site or have others sell your programs
> for you.
>
> IMO, most 'shareware' products aren't delivered with sing a profit
> at first. My rational for that is simply that the customer has an option
> to pay but it allowed to use the product regardless of pay. Timeouts,
> limited capacity, and other licensing schemes can help you a little. They
> can confuse the customer more than anything else -- at what point do you
> (the developer) want to become resposible for the product? For example,
> would you help customers enough to get paid and then slack off? Its just
> a reality that many developers don't stick with things over time. You
> need a good business model more than anything else.
>
type[color=darkred]
>
> Your business model matter more than anything else. Treat it like a
> normal home or brick-and-mortar business. The idea that "the internet"
> is this great store is a myth. It is another medium to reach customers
> just like television became a new medium to salesman who had radio
> and newpapers and word of mouth.
>
> Your sales will depend on many factors. I've had friends who have
> done reasonably well for a few years but it was only to supplement
> their income after they decided to create a good product and decided
> it was ready for others to use.
>
> My email package was developed an supported by two people many years
> ago and they took the shareware route. They had wonderful service that
> few, if any, companies could ever match. They were always around to
> help. They were able to live off the profits and make a great name
> for themselves.
>
> I'm a bit older (40) with 23 years in the business. I've developed
> stuff outside of work for free/share/sale too. If you have an idea
> and business model that can work and you can get the customers to
> beat down your door it may be worth giving it a try.
>
mass-market[color=darkred]
domains[color=darkred]
good[color=darkred]
>
> Your existing customer base is your best reference for your abilities.
> If you plan on moving to the mass market, especially in terms of the
> internet, please accept that offering to sell anything to everyone on the
> planet may not get you more sales or profit than you would talking to
people
> in person and trying to make the sale.
>
a[color=darkred]
usefull[color=darkred]
just[color=darkred]
>
> If one person said they did something like that, does it mean that its
> the right thing for you and your products?
>
>
> If customers spent all their effort trying to find products like yours
> for their needs, what are the chances that they'd find it and then buy it?
>
> If that is your only method for "getting the word out" for your product
> expect zero sales, ever.
>
kind[color=darkred]
>
> Read up on marketing, business practices, and so on. Hopefully you
> picked up a little of this over your years developing products for other
> people. How did they decide what to develop and how to reach the
customer?
>
>
> There are all kinds of places. comp.software-eng is a rather poor place
> to start. You might try listening to some of the posters in the various
> programming groups. See also comp.programming and perhaps anything
related
> to your product ideas and of course sales and marketing.
>
imagine[color=darkred]
app[color=darkred]
>
> Define live with? If you mean "quit your day job" I don't think so.
> That won't happen unless you become a marketing wizard or hook up with
one.
> At best you might supplement your income, especially in the $40 each
> range.
>
>
> A professional developer typically works for gauranteed pay or other
> incentives. Even if you had a great game or whatever, its the salesman
> in you that would translate the product into money.
>
> You should probably examine what you are trying to do and see if there
> is a better way of going about it. You may have some very good ideas
> and growth potential. It won't happen over night.
>
questions.[color=darkred]
>
> David
>
| |
|
| Stephane,
On Sun, 1 Aug 2004 12:20:43 UTC, "Stephan Jullian"
<seriousguy06@hotmail.com> wrote:
> Thanks David for your advices,
You're welcome.
> does this mean that shareware developers can't live from their software ?
No it doesn't. My observation is that only a few of many hundreds or
perhaps
thousands of such shareware projects would be considered a success based on
the money they brought in. While the odds are not in your favor, you and
you ideas are worth exploring. Regardless, it will take time for you to
achieve such a goal. I just didn't want you to expect that it will come
quickly and without a lot of work. Not many businesses (shareware or
commerical) pay for themselves and become profitable.
> Do you know developer who can ? How much is the average earning among your
> relatives in this business ?
If your goal is to make a sustainable living based on your work, I don't
think shareware would be a good approach. I've talked with several
excellent
developers over the years that have made money for a time based on their
shareware. The list I can name to myself right now is about six people.
Five of them accomplished their goals of delivering a product that people
found useful. The impetus for starting their projects was generally a
personal need and only later turned into an opportunity to share their work
with others. For every paying customer there were many users that didn't
pay.
I think three of them did live off their work for a time. I know two of
them
had a thriving business for at least three years. The product is still
around,
though its been sold to another (small) group. The original developers
had an excellent reputation for their work and were offered positions that
made use of their excelent mix of development, support, and business
strategy. The two stated they were able to live after college (for 3
years?)
and pay off some debt. Obviously being offered higher than normal paying
jobs to tackle other tasks and being able to sell their dwindling business
was a good step for them. However, just because their business model was
for shareware, they treated it as a formal business, and eventually decided
it was better for them to move into commercial ventures.
> How much is the average earning among your relatives in this business ?
I only have a clue about one such individuals earnings. His projects
payed perhaps $100 USD per month for almost a year. He is a close friend
that I have worked with. His project brought in money because it filled
a niche that people wanted a solution for and were willing to pay. I think
the price was $40 or so for the full product and he eventually had some site
selling his software for him. He didn't make much money after that. He
was never in it for the money. He had no intention of quitting his daytime
programming job.
I've heard of parents becoming shareware developers in the course of
writing teaching material for their kids and sharing those with other
parents. I have no idea what income that might have generated. I'm sure
it was well worth the effort to them though.
<IMHO>
If your goal is to make money and work on your own terms, I'd suggest
some sort of formal commercial venture. Shareware isn't likely to meet
your needs. You stated that you have several years developing good
applications and have a good reputation. You might want to explore
the business aspects of what you are thinking of. Read books, perhaps
take a few courses or get an MBA. Even talking with your leadership at
work could yield insight. Those are probably the areas you need to
explore along with your ideas for new products and services.
The follopwing questions are for you alone. They don't need to be
answered here.
What is your definition of income that would be worth your full time
attention? What would you really need to make? [Hint, in the USA,
you might be considered self employed and thus need to make two or
three time more than that just to make what you want.] Consider other
expenses that might be covered by your day job like health insurance,
time off, and so on.
Can you keep generating new and/or improved ideas that will take over
income before other ideas have outlasted their usefulness?
<IMHO/>
I've known several laid off people who have created their own
businesses and are quite content. Most started out as selling their
own programming, LAN management, service and support, or other
services they knew they could handle. Two with enough business
and the business sense to handle a company hired more people
and now have a couple people working for them. You can probably
make a living like this doing contract development work in your
location for several companies. You don't need 100% workload
from one company; spread the load around and try to help the
companies that need small focussed projects done. Many web
businesses (as in web hosting and design) follow this kind
of model.
David
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