Using TrueType Fonts with Ghostscript....

Hans-Werner Hilse wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> On Tue, 28 Feb 2006 19:08:47 -0500 PDFrank <pdfrank@some.net> wrote:
> 
>
> Sorry, but there's nothing wrong with the fonts embedded. But you are
> continuing to spread FUD on ghostscript. The fonts are, in fact,
> perfectly embedded. The only thing that stops copy & paste is a known
> charset which is set to "user defined". It's still a perfectly valid
> PDF.
>
> Why are you continuously badmouthing ghostscript? Don't tell me things
> that apply to versions that are outdated today...
>
> -hwh

... and, the fonts seem to be converted from TrueType to Type1. If you look
 into the PDF, you will see
font names like Arial_Black0233, and in the encoding you see glyph names lik
e G055 etc., which obviously
are generated by some font conversion process or a (windows-based?) printer 
driver.

PDFrank, Please tell us the history of the file's   creation (application, p
latform, etc.).

Helge

--
Helge Blischke
Softwareentwicklung
SRZ Berlin | Firmengruppe besscom
http://www.srz.de

It was My file. (-;

We are using a Programming Language Called Powerbuilder from Sybase. We are
printing directly to a Locally defined printer, "Sybase DataWindow PS". that
printer is using the Adobe Distiller as its Driver.

I cannot seem to print directly to the defined printer and generate a PDF.

The Code in the Application requires that there be a GS folder in the
Application Directory and in that folder there needs to be a folder with the
name of   "gs7.06"  though the version of ghostscript that is in there does
not seem to matter.

When I started with version 8.15 the Fonts that showed up in the Document
Properties were Type3 and had names like T3Font_6.  I upgraded to 8.53 and
that is when they Switched to Type1

I don't really care if they are embedded or not. I don't care if I need to
change the Font to Helvetica or something similar.  When our sales people
create the Quote, they want to be able to copy and paste information from
the PDF to another document.

I know that somehow the Powerbuilder code or the  "Sybase DataWindow PS"
printer is calling/using the scripts in the lib folder as I can change
things in them and get different results in the PDF.

What do I need to change to let it know that I want to use a normal encoding
for the fonts so they can be copy and pasted?

Thank you,
Scott<-


"Helge Blischke" <h.blischke@srz.de> wrote in message
news:44059C29.12C7A8EC@srz.de...
> Hans-Werner Hilse wrote: 
>
> ... and, the fonts seem to be converted from TrueType to Type1. If you
> look into the PDF, you will see
> font names like Arial_Black0233, and in the encoding you see glyph names
> like G055 etc., which obviously
> are generated by some font conversion process or a (windows-based?)
> printer driver.
>
> PDFrank, Please tell us the history of the file's   creation (application,
> platform, etc.).
>
> Helge
>
> --
> Helge Blischke
> Softwareentwicklung
> SRZ Berlin | Firmengruppe besscom
> http://www.srz.de

As I mentioned in my other reply, it does not matter to me if they are
embedded or not. The Smaller the file the better actually. I'm not familiar
with Ghostscript. Our Programming environment just says, put this folder
here and print to ""Sybase DataWindow PS" and it will work. Other then that
there is no other info on how to adjust the creation of the PDF.

I know it was probably lame to most of you who know how to manipulate a PDF,
but the big white rectangle with the red border was to cover the customer
info on the quote.

If I knew what fonts to use to not embed them and what options/changes I
need to make to allow them to be normally encoded so I can copy and paste
text from it, I'd be more then happy to make the changes.

Thank you,
Scott<-
"PDFrank" <pdfrank@some.net> wrote in message
news:14qdnTVfU_mIe5nZRVn-rw@rcn.net...
> Scott Townsend wrote: 
>
> That's what's going to happen when you use Ghostscript to embed fonts.
>
> I wish people would stop doing it. The world doesn't need any more bad
> PDFs.
>
> (And if the big white rectangle with the red border was intended to
> "redact" the doc, that's a bad idea too.)

Hi,

On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 15:48:36 GMT "Scott Townsend"
<scott-i@.-N0-SPAMplease.enm.com> wrote:

> As I mentioned in my other reply, it does not matter to me if they
> are embedded or not.

Well, it doesn't matter as long the RIP does The Right Thing (TM)...

> The Smaller the file the better actually. I'm
> not familiar with Ghostscript. Our Programming environment just says,
> put this folder here and print to ""Sybase DataWindow PS" and it will
> work. Other then that there is no other info on how to adjust the
> creation of the PDF.

Googling a bit I found this:
http://manuals.sybase.com/onlineboo...iew/1159;pt=168

I guess this is what you're speaking about?

Did you install the mentioned adist5.inf (Adobe Distiller profile, I
guess) printer driver or a custom (other) one?

> If I knew what fonts to use to not embed them and what
> options/changes I need to make to allow them to be normally encoded
> so I can copy and paste text from it, I'd be more then happy to make
> the changes.

Start with trying to print with another app to the "Sybase DataWindow
PS" driver. Maybe you can put the results for a few fonts online, too,
so we have a chance to inspect them.

BTW, whereas pdftotext (from xpdf suite) doesn't manage to extract the
text, Adobe Acrobat doesn't show any problems for me with the sample
doc you've linked.

-hwh

Hans-Werner Hilse wrote:

> Sorry, but there's nothing wrong with the fonts embedded. But you are
> continuing to spread FUD on ghostscript. The fonts are, in fact,
> perfectly embedded. The only thing that stops copy & paste is a known
> charset which is set to "user defined". It's still a perfectly valid
> PDF.
>
> Why are you continuously badmouthing ghostscript? Don't tell me things
> that apply to versions that are outdated today...

I like Ghostscript. I use Ghostscript.

I don't like it when people use Ghostscript to make "perfectly valid"
PDFs (with "perfectly embedded" fonts) that are all screwed up.

Because then I have to go through the trouble of fixing them to make
them searchable.

Hi,

On Wed, 01 Mar 2006 23:06:07 -0500 PDFrank <pdfrank@some.net> wrote:
 
>
> I like Ghostscript. I use Ghostscript.
>
> I don't like it when people use Ghostscript to make "perfectly valid"
> PDFs (with "perfectly embedded" fonts) that are all screwed up.
>
> Because then I have to go through the trouble of fixing them to make
> them searchable.

:-) OK, so it was just an accidental rant... I can pretty well
understand that. And in fact, you're quite right if I understand the
documentation page "ps2pdf.htm" from CVS version correctly:
--snip--
Ghostscript has been writing incorrect ToUnicode CMap without CMapName
into the PDF since version 8.10 (rev. 3611) . This bug is fixed in
version 8.54 (rev. 6201). We recommend to re-generate PDF files created
by the affected Ghostscript versions. Since version 8.54 (rev. 6590)
Ghostscript can read the incorrect PDF files.
--snip--

So I let you continue to rant ;-)

-hwh

I've linked all the files I mention here:
http://www.enm.com/pdfissues/


"Hans-Werner Hilse" <hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de> wrote in message
news:20060301185910.ae89cef4.hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de...

> Googling a bit I found this:
> http://manuals.sybase.com/onlineboo...iew/1159;pt=168
>
> I guess this is what you're speaking about?

Yes, that is what We have done.

>
> Did you install the mentioned adist5.inf (Adobe Distiller profile, I
> guess) printer driver or a custom (other) one?

The printer "Sybase DataWindow PS" is created automaticaly when you print if
its not already there. Its Driver is Acrobat Distiller.

I've also created a printer using the Supplied Adist5.inf file.

>
> Start with trying to print with another app to the "Sybase DataWindow
> PS" driver. Maybe you can put the results for a few fonts online, too,
> so we have a chance to inspect them.

I've printed test pages with both and both are not readable by Acrobat.
They do have PS Contents in the file, but something is not formatted right.

>
> BTW, whereas pdftotext (from xpdf suite) doesn't manage to extract the
> text, Adobe Acrobat doesn't show any problems for me with the sample
> doc you've linked.

Yeah, the Documents look great...  The customers do not seem to complain
when they get them, though the sales people want to be able to copy and
paste info from them, and that's the real issue.

I've Posted my Docs here:     http://www.enm.com/pdfissues/

I've added a few new Quotes, one from GS 8.15 and one from GS 8.53. The
funny thing was when I tried to Downgrade my 8.53 install back to 8.15, the
fonts when printed with the 8.15 are embedded like the 8.53. I had to go to
another machine to get the real 8.15 output.

So should I install 8.54?

Thank you for your assistance in this. It is appreciated!
Scott<-

Hi,

On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 15:42:38 GMT "Scott Townsend"
<scott-i@.-N0-SPAMplease.enm.com> wrote:

> I've linked all the files I mention here:
>     http://www.enm.com/pdfissues/

OK, luckily, those aren't PDFs but the originating Postscript. Thus I
can now tell that the "garbage" is produced by the printer driver
(adist5.ppd in combination with pscript.dll) which seems to be very
outdated (v.4.00, according to the test page).

Postscript created with Adobe's newest postscript driver and adist5.ppd
available from
[url]http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/product.jsp?product=44&platform=Windows[/ur
l]
contains a more proper encoding for me.

So my suggestion would be to visit that side and install the newest
driver. The adist5.ppd is in the "PPD Files" section a bit down the
mentioned page (under "PPD Files: Adobe"). You need to download it
before starting to install the postscript driver (top of the page) as
you'll be asked for that PPD then.

Most probably that will do the trick.

> I've added a few new Quotes, one from GS 8.15 and one from GS 8.53.
> The funny thing was when I tried to Downgrade my 8.53 install back to
> 8.15, the fonts when printed with the 8.15 are embedded like the
> 8.53. I had to go to another machine to get the real 8.15 output.
>
> So should I install 8.54?

Errr, if you want ;-) But that's only the name for the CVS version
which is still in development before the definate 8.54 gets published.
So you'll probably have to compile it yourself which I have no
experience with -- on Windows. I think upgrading your Postscript driver
should do.

-hwh

I'll give that a Whirl and see what I come up with!

Thanks!
"Hans-Werner Hilse" <hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de> wrote in message
news:20060302174054.702ae2f6.hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de...
> Hi,
>
> On Thu, 02 Mar 2006 15:42:38 GMT "Scott Townsend"
> <scott-i@.-N0-SPAMplease.enm.com> wrote:
> 
>
> OK, luckily, those aren't PDFs but the originating Postscript. Thus I
> can now tell that the "garbage" is produced by the printer driver
> (adist5.ppd in combination with pscript.dll) which seems to be very
> outdated (v.4.00, according to the test page).
>
> Postscript created with Adobe's newest postscript driver and adist5.ppd
> available from
> [url]http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/product.jsp?product=44&platform=Windows[/
url]
> contains a more proper encoding for me.
>
> So my suggestion would be to visit that side and install the newest
> driver. The adist5.ppd is in the "PPD Files" section a bit down the
> mentioned page (under "PPD Files: Adobe"). You need to download it
> before starting to install the postscript driver (top of the page) as
> you'll be asked for that PPD then.
>
> Most probably that will do the trick.
> 
>
> Errr, if you want ;-) But that's only the name for the CVS version
> which is still in development before the definate 8.54 gets published.
> So you'll probably have to compile it yourself which I have no
> experience with -- on Windows. I think upgrading your Postscript driver
> should do.
>
> -hwh

Scott Townsend wrote:
>
> I'll give that a Whirl and see what I come up with!
>
> Thanks!
> "Hans-Werner Hilse" <hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de> wrote in message
> news:20060302174054.702ae2f6.hw.hilse@stud.ugoe.de... 

According to the DataWindows installation guide (found on google), the defau
lt printer driver
does not permit creation of searchable PDF (as it installs the NT4 kernel mo
de PostScript driver,
which  converts TrueType fonts to Type1 and, of couse, does font subsetting 
and in any case
uses a custom encoding for the generated Type1 font subsets which depend on 
the sequence
the requested glyphs appear in the input sream).

If you install the "official" PS driver for W2K and upwards, you must patch 
your DataWindows
afterwards as described in the installation guide (see http://download.sybase.com/
..50e/dwninst.pdf)

Helge

--
Helge Blischke
Softwareentwicklung
SRZ Berlin | Firmengruppe besscom
http://www.srz.de